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21 November 2008 @ 10:02 am


I'm really trying to suspend my disbelief here, show. I still love you. Let me just put that out there, up front. And it's incredibly brave what you're doing this season, bringing God and the angels into it. At first I was super excited about this. And you made Castiel exactly what I thought an angel would be.


Dear Kripke and Co.,

You're messing with my religion, and it's messing with my suspension of disbelief.

A couple of notes:

Uriel is an Archangel. Look it up! Of the seven Archangels - these would be the Seraphim, the highest, most powerful angels in charge of all the others, btw - the four most likely to sit by God's right hand, so to speak, are Michael, Gabriel, Rafael, and Uriel. It was Uriel who was sent to take the firstborn in Egypt.

I'm having kind of a hard time believing that Castiel outranks him. Not to mention Anna.

Also, this picture you're painting, of angels and God in general? Really not liking it much. Now, some things are pretty darn cool, like the idea of the angels' grace and some of their powers, and even their righteousness, to a point. But this idea that angels and God are kind of no better than demons and Lucifer is not winning you any points with me!

ETA: Oh, and another thing. Angels do not have to have faith. That is what separates them from man among God's creations. That is why man is more beloved of God than the angels - because angels KNOW God exists, while man must believe on faith. This kind of goes back to why Lucifer fell, just so you know.

No love,

Now that I've made myself clear on that, some other thinky thoughts:

~ So, Dean's sleeping with the angel while Sam's doing a demon? The irony, it is painful.

But also, I am not surprised that Dean and Anna hooked up. I would like it a lot more if I thought they might actually bring Anna back at some point, but I find the idea very doubtful. Once one of the boys expresses an interest in a girl on this show, it's the kiss of death. Except for Ruby, so far, but I'm sure her days are numbered.

But for the first time, I am actually tempted to write fic for this show. I can see lots of potential in having the boys, with their angelic and demonic girlfriends popping in and out as they travel around saving people. Yes. I like that a lot.

~ Oh, Dean. Jeezus. I wanted to hug and cuddle him at the end. Like Sam said, you held out for thirty years! That's more than most people would have, I'm thinking.

~ Who in the heck is Alastair, that he's that dang powerful? It looked kinda like he got destroyed when Anna took back her grace, but I'm not sure of that.

~ Oh, Ruby. You continue to grow on me, which only reinforces my belief that you are tragically doomed. I've been hoping that you'd actually find redemption, but if the angels and God on this show aren't prepared to forgive one of their own, your chances of the same are slim to a snowball's in a really hot place. (Again, herein lies my problem. Where's the love and forgiveness? Sure, God can be wrathful and his angels are dangerous and righteous, but where is the love and forgiveness aspect???) I loved that Ruby's "betrayal" was all part of the plan. And Sam seemed worried about her, while not being TOO worried. Still, I wouldn't have minded a little bit more emotion from him. Maybe he was holding back in front of Dean.

~ JANUARY 15TH???? Are you serious? GAH!!!!!!!!!!

~ Castiel is still my favorite angel. I'm really not liking Uriel or how he's being portrayed, and we didn't get to see enough of Anna for her to overtake Cas.

kistha, I know, I know - this show has messed with your religion and gotten it wrong so often, it's about time it messed with/up mine, too, I suppose. I'm trying to grit my teeth and remind myself it's just a TV show.
Current Mood: annoyedannoyed
The Proverbial Bull in a China Shop...: Castielsabaceanbabe on November 21st, 2008 06:23 pm (UTC)
I've seen other posts from people upset (some to the point of no longer watching) with how God and the angels are being portrayed. My own take is that, other than when it's just blatantly wrong (Uriel being lower ranking or Samhain being a demon), they're doing something that seems to be internally logical (as opposed to RL Bible logical) and based entirely on the Old Testament, where I really don't recall all that much forgiveness, at least not without some major acts of contrition (I'm not Catholic, but rather Lutheran).

(And just this moment, I had the thought that maybe this is deliberate and if there is a fifth season, maybe they'll bring in the New Testament and right the wrongs.)

The portrayal has bothered me a bit, yes, but it's not suspending my suspension of disbelief as Heroes has this season. :)
rhienellethrhienelleth on November 21st, 2008 06:38 pm (UTC)
See, I could maybe buy that they were sticking with Old Testament, except that...I don't know. I just don't. I have some really specific views, I guess, on Old Testament God and new Testament God and angels in general. Messing up who Uriel is, is probably coloring my view of everything else they're doing on the show, I'll admit. (How hard is it to research this, show? Gustov Davidson's A Dictionary of Angels: Including the Fallen Ones, which he spent 16 years and every text he could get his hands on researching, would be an excellent place to start! I have an extra copy, Kripke.)

I just...don't buy that they're going with Old Testament God and that's an explanation for making God and his angels the equivalent of a supernatural mafia, or whatever. Especially since the timeline of the show is definitely New Testament - modern times certainly being after Jesus died on the cross.

I don't know. I feel like they were so close to doing this right, and now I'm just not sure what they're doing or where they're going with it. I'm afraid they're making angels just another supernatural boogeyman, and as for God...I'm afraid the direction they're going may ruin the show for me. I really, really hope not. But I am afraid it might.
The Proverbial Bull in a China Shop...: Sam Winchester awkwardsabaceanbabe on November 21st, 2008 06:50 pm (UTC)
The Uriel thing is really big, yeah, considering Castiel = Angel of Thursday. They had to do some research to get that, right? And they couldn't research Uriel? Which would be considerably less difficult to find anything?

I, too, hope they have a plan that doesn't involve making equalizing angels and demons and trivializing God. This season has just been so good so far, I'm keeping my fingers crossed that the second half will continue with that and clear up any confusion, answer some questions, and fall into place without destroying the show.
MiniOrr: SPN: Metallicarminiglik on November 21st, 2008 07:01 pm (UTC)
I just...don't buy that they're going with Old Testament God and that's an explanation for making God and his angels the equivalent of a supernatural mafia, or whatever. Especially since the timeline of the show is definitely New Testament - modern times certainly being after Jesus died on the cross.

It's because God is not God and the angels aren't the angels. This isn't really supposed to be about theology, it's just a classic Good Superpower v. Bad Superpower, where you find out the Good Superpower can be every bit as evil as the Bad Superpower in pursuit of the defeat of their enemy. They just decided the Bible and Judaism/Christianity would give them some good characters, I believe.
"Connoisseurs of Difficulty": Dodge Thiskistha on November 21st, 2008 08:01 pm (UTC)
From what I can discover Castiel's real world first appearance (as far as I can find) was on an Angel Tarot set, so probably is a late comer added in recent "touchy feely times." (I don't have the book you have, and have not checked out the book's research either.) Also I kept thinking his name was Cassiel (who is a listed in the Kabala & the Torah) which explains my confusion. I also think it's kind of stupid to use Uriel as a regular angel, and the four that have seen God, should certainly be the 4 main archangels, which would include Uriel the Angel of Death. So if Uriel wasn't there it would all be fine - since they'd be not real. Just like the God of Samhain isn't Samhain. It's a holiday not a person.

And, while they fuck with the large spectrum of the religion I'm from, at least it's none of my God/desses.

I didn't really like where the show went either. I did totally want to snuggle Dean at the end (they made him cry. They should die now.) I don't like the idea that the angels don't know their God as it makes no sense whatsoever in any Jewish or Christian way. As for the love and forgiveness aspect I can kind of live without it, but since Angels have no free will, it's not like they should even notice there's a problem. So, yeah not really liking the direction it went - and hoping that somehow things get straightened out.

And, biggest bitch: January 15th SERIOUSLY!?!??! Now I'm going to have conflicts when Burn Notice comes back around the same time! And why are we taking this huge fucking break? Just skip Thanksgiving and Christmas, damn it!